Hey,

I was freechatting in #TBS this evening and I posited that perhaps ranking alone is not enough for op status in the TBS channel. I know when I first joined #tbs, as a n00b without a clue of how these things worked, had an op approached me for any reason, their request would have had an instant gravitas. After all, they were @ in #tbs!

However it is in fact only the number of challenges solved that gives anyone @ in #tbs - this is not necessarily a reflection of someone who is prepared to maintain and enforce the values of bright-shadows.

I could set up a second account and trade my way to #5. In all honesty I have not entered the solutions to over 10 challenges because they were offered to me as a 'goodwill' attempt to trade. Just because I could put myself in the top #5 to be an op would not mean I was worthy of being an op.

But, as I mentioned in the channel, this could just me being bitter because I don't have the skillz to be in the top 5. I don't think we can stop trading at TBS, but I think in the channel we can at least enforce a minimum skill level.

So - my idea was that once an individual had qualified to be an @ (I dunno - let's say top 10 - that way it excludes me ) and that person is prepared to be online for xx hours a week (hey - what is the point of having @ if they are not there to aid the community?) they should have to prove their worth. Whether by way of input to the forums, solving a customised challenge that involved some of the key skills they would have needed to be @ or something that I have plain overlooked. I not too proud to admit that I may have missed something - I would just value a solution that prevented pure traders being able to leech solutions off new people who join just because being an @ gives them the ability to do so.

Let's break the circle peepz - let's make @ something to be proud of.

Else I'll take one just for giggles

\o/

At least something valuable on the site since many months...
bb I put you a +1

In fact it's one of the reasons which explains why I'm no more online on #tbs. I'm realy tired of all this mess...
I could be op. I know this. Why should I be ?!?
There are some guys on tbs who are really better than me and the number of these guys is greater than 5. I'll not say nicknames. I'm sure everybody know who I'm talking about...

It's really sad for the site. All the valuable challengers are no more in the ranking page...
I feel stupid to be there while better than me are not but I can't resign myself in leaving this site like this. That's all :/
I just spent too many time there...

Sorry I just wanted to add my opinion after bb's post.

irc is a time sucking vortex from hell don't get trapped

no seriously .. why bother.

In my opinion, rhican, the irc can be a time sucking hell vortex, but it can also help you learn. I've learned more on the tbs chatroom then I could have ever learned by myself. Granted that not everything I learned is challenge related, but I got some good pointers there in anything I asked. I even got interested in C++ while I was in there and started learning some of the basics of the language. I agree that some people spend too much time in IRC, but it does have its purpose. You may not agree with me, but that's the way I feel about it.

Hey bb, S0410N3
Just like you, I also think that just being in the top 5 doesn't get you an @ automatically An @ needs to be active and helpful. But instead of having him solve a special challenge, I would suggest a simpler and more reliable way: an election
How about letting people who have joined tbs for at least a year and have solved at least 150 challs voice their opinions? I believe if an user has solved at least 150 challs and has been around for a year he should be active enough to know the candidate he is voting for. And what's more important is that you can't create a fake account just to cast fake votes
Oh and I believe that an @ should have some power on the site too Say, how about giving him the ability to edit posts/upload new challs? I know this idea has been mentioned many times but now we really need to make a move on *cough* there are still many pending challs

PS1: S0410N3, you should come to the irc channel more often. We're having an irc bot contest here
PS2: bb, you can be an @ at #tbs-botzone if you like The only prerequisite is that you need to run a bot



P.S. (Changed channel name)

Brilliant idea!



And perhaps already uploaded a challenge. Something educational ... not a silly "JMKAGhjkljkcsyKJGIgk" crypto of a "hunt the wordlist" style crackit. Something that has received genuinely good feedback.


I'm not so sure about this. Maybe in the future but for now, let's just see if we can get #tbs back on it's feet. After all the site is not ours. The channel is much moreso. Power on the site should be dispensed by the site owners imho, unless it becomes an 'open source' site.

Personally I think we should prune some of the older crappier challs before we upload new ones. YMMV.


The honour ... my very own @

@rhican : Why bother? Because it used to be a great part of #tbs. I don't think it should be thrown away so easily. That's all

I refuse to vote

really i don't see why it's such a problem.

Don't make it to bureaucratic.

you'll just take the fun out of it really...


I see a few possibilities for IRC to work:
1-as it was ment for: there are active ops/owners and they decide at random who's good enough.
2-there is no hierachy and everybody just fuckzors around.

If you start a voting mechanism, it assure you it will be suboptimal to algorithm 1.

i won't vote. even if i might fall in your "voting category"

always the same ... always the same group of folks who care about TBS .... I just wonder why?

Is it because we love what was once built?
Is it because we love what was once challenging us?
Is it because we all hate traders - and most of use know who they are?
Is it because we love to advance our own knowledge?
Is it because the things we learned and would like to keep this knowledge around & tutor others?

I personally have a lot of different reasons to always come back to TBS .... but I also sense, that there is a barrier, which keeps the community from going further.

Advancing into further levels of reversing, coding & exploiting - which can and will not be subject of competition at TBS - simply for being too advanced due to the fact, that only a handful of folks wish to compete on that level. Which I think is sad. (I'm currently reading a lot about root kits & the technology behind - but that's just my very personal fold of the story)

The TBS community all got us here .... it's very unique ........

... We all tried very different paths advance past TBS and we all went different paths .... some tried other challenge sites & got bored - others tried to code sites, which would prevent cheating & trading from the start .... while others, simply retired with their knowledge. Knowledge which is not only valuable to assist new comers - but also to bring this site .......

............ to the next level ................

(my 2 cents)

PS: missed REA-I due to timing. seen REA-II which is full of advertisement and banned it ...... I just loved to reverse & code ...... but where to turn my energy towards is a very good question

Honestly speaking, I don't see that much of a problem with what's happening as of now.

[Post made before Inferno's pruning of challenges]
Unlike bb's view, I think tha trading isn't going to get you anywhere high in the rankings page. Not top 20, not to mention top 5. So the part about skills required pretty much a non-issue here. Don't believe me? Check the challenge page - look at the number of people who have solved each challenge. Now look at the ranking page. You need 219 challenges to be in top 20, 285 to be in top 5. Now tell me which 285 are you going to trade? Which 285 CAN you trade? Do you honestly think those 10-odd people who've spent hours to solved a harder challenge will give up the answer THAT easily? Do you think that even when offered with the answer of another "hard" challenge, one who has the ability to solve the other hard ones will give in to temptation and just trade the answer?

The problem now as I see it now is the disabling of ranking. Look at me. I have 296 challenges done as of now. I'm ranked 2nd. Yet, if I were to include the others (TheHiveMind, Plasmator, rayden5, Phas, Inferno), I'd be in 7th position, not 2nd. It's still two ranks (and many challenges) away from the top 5. They are obviously much better than I am and deserve @ much more than I do. However, activeness is another issue. Except for Inferno and sometimes Phas, the rest don't frequent the IRC channel anymore.

An election, like all elections, will take some time, and I feel, is entirely unnecessary.
On the other hand, I, similar to rhican, think that perhaps just a few people should vote for say, 3 operators (apart from the admins). The remaining vacant slots can be filled through recommendations and such, on a longer-term basis.

Just my two cents.

I feel the same way. In my opinion, not everyone should have a vote in said election. I myself have only solved around 60, and therefore have not been at this site long enough to know what is best for it. The people who have been here for a long time and have continually supported the challenges and the development of the site are the ones that should be allowed to vote on things. And that may not even include the top 5. As was said, many people would be ranked in the top if they were activated. The question is whether or not those people should be allowed to vote as well. We have to figure out who has the maturity to make decisions that effect everyone on the site. In my opinion, the only people who should be allowed to vote are the ones that have proven they have the maturity, the knowledge, and above all else, the discipline to run the site. If they don't fall under every one of those categories, their vote should not be counted or even considered. But like I said, I'm new. You all may not find my opinions valid or even worthy of considering. But thats okay. I figured I'd just add my 2 cents.